Why doesn't “its” have an apostrophe?Why do we use “its” for possessive?Why is the misspelling of “its” (possessive) so widespread?Why don't we use an apostrophe to denote ownership on 'it'?If apostrophe-S is possessive, should “it's” be used when referring to an object's possessions or not?Its/It's for “It”, but not for other words?Why is there a distinction between “its” and “it's”?Is the possessive of “one” spelled “ones” or “one's”?Where did the practice of using apostrophes for possessive nouns but not pronouns originate?When did it become incorrect to use apostrophes with possessive pronouns?Concerning: its'“It's” versus “its” frequenciesIs [Its'] a word? (Note the apostrophe at the end.)Why do we use “its” for possessive?What possessive pronouns do have an apostrophe?Why 'a friend of mine' is not 'my friend's friend'?Where did the practice of using apostrophes for possessive nouns but not pronouns originate?When did it become incorrect to use apostrophes with possessive pronouns?Why “hoist” in “Hoist with one's own petard”?'Whosever': Why is this word going out of usage?“Indian” comes from Italian/Spanish “gente in dios” (God-like people)? False etymology?
Is the destination of a commercial flight important for the pilot?
Is there any reason not to eat food that's been dropped on the surface of the moon?
How does Loki do this?
Nautlius: add mouse right-click action to compute MD5 sum
System.debug(JSON.Serialize(o)) Not longer shows full string
Sort a list by elements of another list
Does "every" first-order theory have a finitely axiomatizable conservative extension?
How to escape string to filename? It is in backup a file append date
Is this apparent Class Action settlement a spam message?
What does this 7 mean above the f flat
Is it okay for two “sein” to be next to each other?
Overloading istream>> to read comma-separated input
What can we do to stop prior company from asking us questions?
Balance Issues for a Custom Sorcerer Variant
What to do with wrong results in talks?
Fastening aluminum fascia to wooden subfascia
Lay out the Carpet
Hostile work environment after whistle-blowing on coworker and our boss. What do I do?
Avoiding estate tax by giving multiple gifts
Where does the Z80 processor start executing from?
How to be diplomatic in refusing to write code that breaches the privacy of our users
Is HostGator storing my password in plaintext?
How did Doctor Strange see the winning outcome in Avengers: Infinity War?
What is the difference between "behavior" and "behaviour"?
Why doesn't “its” have an apostrophe?
Why do we use “its” for possessive?Why is the misspelling of “its” (possessive) so widespread?Why don't we use an apostrophe to denote ownership on 'it'?If apostrophe-S is possessive, should “it's” be used when referring to an object's possessions or not?Its/It's for “It”, but not for other words?Why is there a distinction between “its” and “it's”?Is the possessive of “one” spelled “ones” or “one's”?Where did the practice of using apostrophes for possessive nouns but not pronouns originate?When did it become incorrect to use apostrophes with possessive pronouns?Concerning: its'“It's” versus “its” frequenciesIs [Its'] a word? (Note the apostrophe at the end.)Why do we use “its” for possessive?What possessive pronouns do have an apostrophe?Why 'a friend of mine' is not 'my friend's friend'?Where did the practice of using apostrophes for possessive nouns but not pronouns originate?When did it become incorrect to use apostrophes with possessive pronouns?Why “hoist” in “Hoist with one's own petard”?'Whosever': Why is this word going out of usage?“Indian” comes from Italian/Spanish “gente in dios” (God-like people)? False etymology?
I know that its is the possessive and it's is the contraction, and know when to use them. But why doesn't the possessive have an apostrophe?
- "The bear's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "The bear's coat is brown." [possessive]
- "It's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "Its coat is brown." [possessive]
- "One's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "One's coat is brown." [possessive]
Wiktionary lists the etymology as "From it + 's", and Online Etymology Dictionary says that this is actually the original form:
Originally written it's, and still deliberately spelled thus by some writers until early 1800s.
So what happened to the apostrophe? When did people stop using it, and why did they?
It seems that it's as the possessive is more natural, as most people do this until they're taught that it is wrong (or even after).
Update: Online Etymology Dictionary has been updated to include two potential explanations:
The apostrophe came to be omitted, perhaps because it's already was established as a contraction of it is, or by general habit of omitting apostrophes in personal pronouns (hers, yours, theirs, etc.).
Can anyone back up either of these arguments? The possessive one's still has the apostrophe, despite these.
pronouns history possessives
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
|
show 2 more comments
I know that its is the possessive and it's is the contraction, and know when to use them. But why doesn't the possessive have an apostrophe?
- "The bear's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "The bear's coat is brown." [possessive]
- "It's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "Its coat is brown." [possessive]
- "One's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "One's coat is brown." [possessive]
Wiktionary lists the etymology as "From it + 's", and Online Etymology Dictionary says that this is actually the original form:
Originally written it's, and still deliberately spelled thus by some writers until early 1800s.
So what happened to the apostrophe? When did people stop using it, and why did they?
It seems that it's as the possessive is more natural, as most people do this until they're taught that it is wrong (or even after).
Update: Online Etymology Dictionary has been updated to include two potential explanations:
The apostrophe came to be omitted, perhaps because it's already was established as a contraction of it is, or by general habit of omitting apostrophes in personal pronouns (hers, yours, theirs, etc.).
Can anyone back up either of these arguments? The possessive one's still has the apostrophe, despite these.
pronouns history possessives
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
1
possible duplicate of Why is there a distinction between "its" and "it's"?
– MrHen
Apr 25 '11 at 18:05
4
@MrHen: the accepted answer to that question doesn't answer this one, in fact it contradicts the evidence presented here.
– RegDwigнt♦
Apr 25 '11 at 18:19
1
Also check here for a similar question.
– boehj
May 28 '11 at 5:51
3
I better point out as a Wiktionary contributor myself that it is just a wiki that anybody can edit much like here anybody can answer. We never have had any contributors who are trained in etymology or lexicography. We try our best but we don't claim to be authoritative.
– hippietrail
May 28 '11 at 7:58
2
+1 for giving sufficient background that my first guess at an explanation was rendered invalid before I finished reading the question.
– Ryan Reich
May 28 '11 at 12:46
|
show 2 more comments
I know that its is the possessive and it's is the contraction, and know when to use them. But why doesn't the possessive have an apostrophe?
- "The bear's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "The bear's coat is brown." [possessive]
- "It's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "Its coat is brown." [possessive]
- "One's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "One's coat is brown." [possessive]
Wiktionary lists the etymology as "From it + 's", and Online Etymology Dictionary says that this is actually the original form:
Originally written it's, and still deliberately spelled thus by some writers until early 1800s.
So what happened to the apostrophe? When did people stop using it, and why did they?
It seems that it's as the possessive is more natural, as most people do this until they're taught that it is wrong (or even after).
Update: Online Etymology Dictionary has been updated to include two potential explanations:
The apostrophe came to be omitted, perhaps because it's already was established as a contraction of it is, or by general habit of omitting apostrophes in personal pronouns (hers, yours, theirs, etc.).
Can anyone back up either of these arguments? The possessive one's still has the apostrophe, despite these.
pronouns history possessives
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
I know that its is the possessive and it's is the contraction, and know when to use them. But why doesn't the possessive have an apostrophe?
- "The bear's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "The bear's coat is brown." [possessive]
- "It's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "Its coat is brown." [possessive]
- "One's eating a fish." [contraction]
- "One's coat is brown." [possessive]
Wiktionary lists the etymology as "From it + 's", and Online Etymology Dictionary says that this is actually the original form:
Originally written it's, and still deliberately spelled thus by some writers until early 1800s.
So what happened to the apostrophe? When did people stop using it, and why did they?
It seems that it's as the possessive is more natural, as most people do this until they're taught that it is wrong (or even after).
Update: Online Etymology Dictionary has been updated to include two potential explanations:
The apostrophe came to be omitted, perhaps because it's already was established as a contraction of it is, or by general habit of omitting apostrophes in personal pronouns (hers, yours, theirs, etc.).
Can anyone back up either of these arguments? The possessive one's still has the apostrophe, despite these.
pronouns history possessives
pronouns history possessives
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
edited Oct 17 '13 at 1:40
endolith
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
asked Apr 25 '11 at 17:46
endolithendolith
3451411
3451411
1
possible duplicate of Why is there a distinction between "its" and "it's"?
– MrHen
Apr 25 '11 at 18:05
4
@MrHen: the accepted answer to that question doesn't answer this one, in fact it contradicts the evidence presented here.
– RegDwigнt♦
Apr 25 '11 at 18:19
1
Also check here for a similar question.
– boehj
May 28 '11 at 5:51
3
I better point out as a Wiktionary contributor myself that it is just a wiki that anybody can edit much like here anybody can answer. We never have had any contributors who are trained in etymology or lexicography. We try our best but we don't claim to be authoritative.
– hippietrail
May 28 '11 at 7:58
2
+1 for giving sufficient background that my first guess at an explanation was rendered invalid before I finished reading the question.
– Ryan Reich
May 28 '11 at 12:46
|
show 2 more comments
1
possible duplicate of Why is there a distinction between "its" and "it's"?
– MrHen
Apr 25 '11 at 18:05
4
@MrHen: the accepted answer to that question doesn't answer this one, in fact it contradicts the evidence presented here.
– RegDwigнt♦
Apr 25 '11 at 18:19
1
Also check here for a similar question.
– boehj
May 28 '11 at 5:51
3
I better point out as a Wiktionary contributor myself that it is just a wiki that anybody can edit much like here anybody can answer. We never have had any contributors who are trained in etymology or lexicography. We try our best but we don't claim to be authoritative.
– hippietrail
May 28 '11 at 7:58
2
+1 for giving sufficient background that my first guess at an explanation was rendered invalid before I finished reading the question.
– Ryan Reich
May 28 '11 at 12:46
1
1
possible duplicate of Why is there a distinction between "its" and "it's"?
– MrHen
Apr 25 '11 at 18:05
possible duplicate of Why is there a distinction between "its" and "it's"?
– MrHen
Apr 25 '11 at 18:05
4
4
@MrHen: the accepted answer to that question doesn't answer this one, in fact it contradicts the evidence presented here.
– RegDwigнt♦
Apr 25 '11 at 18:19
@MrHen: the accepted answer to that question doesn't answer this one, in fact it contradicts the evidence presented here.
– RegDwigнt♦
Apr 25 '11 at 18:19
1
1
Also check here for a similar question.
– boehj
May 28 '11 at 5:51
Also check here for a similar question.
– boehj
May 28 '11 at 5:51
3
3
I better point out as a Wiktionary contributor myself that it is just a wiki that anybody can edit much like here anybody can answer. We never have had any contributors who are trained in etymology or lexicography. We try our best but we don't claim to be authoritative.
– hippietrail
May 28 '11 at 7:58
I better point out as a Wiktionary contributor myself that it is just a wiki that anybody can edit much like here anybody can answer. We never have had any contributors who are trained in etymology or lexicography. We try our best but we don't claim to be authoritative.
– hippietrail
May 28 '11 at 7:58
2
2
+1 for giving sufficient background that my first guess at an explanation was rendered invalid before I finished reading the question.
– Ryan Reich
May 28 '11 at 12:46
+1 for giving sufficient background that my first guess at an explanation was rendered invalid before I finished reading the question.
– Ryan Reich
May 28 '11 at 12:46
|
show 2 more comments
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
Professor David Crystal explains it in his book The Fight for English: How language pundits ate, shot, and left (Crystal 2006), pp. 134-135:
Its is just as possessive as cat's, but it doesn't have an apostrophe. Why not? Because the printers and grammarians [of the nineteenth century - Alex B.] never thought the matter through [emphasis mine - Alex B.]. They applied their rule to nouns and forgot about pronouns, thus creating an exception (along with the food is hers, ours, yours, theirs) without realizing it. And even if they had noticed, they wouldn't have done anything about it, for it's was already taken, as it were, as the abbreviation of it is.
I highly recommend this book to anyone interested in languages.
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
1
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
add a comment |
Here are some possessive pronouns:
- My neighbour
- Your friend
- His wife
- Her dog
- Its tail
None of these have apostrophes. See Martin Beckett's answer for the rest.
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
1
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
4
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
5
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
3
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
2
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
|
show 11 more comments
I was told that the possessive apostrophe was originally a contraction.
"The bear's coat" was originally "the bear his coat" and the apostrophe appeared as the his was gradually shortened — so it would make sense that it is had an apostrophe but its didn't.
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
1
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
15
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
7
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
add a comment |
I read through this thread and found that you really do not have an answer. The etymology of all these words, adjectives and pronouns alike, is confusing, to say the least. Additionally, it seems that there are conflicting reasons for everything. Some say that there used to be apostrophes with certain adjectives/pronouns, and some say they never existed. But let me try to help to make this simple. First and foremost, we need to recognize the different categories we have here. We have possessive adjectives and possessive pronouns. For example, hers is a possessive pronoun, while *her" is a possessive adjective, in our current context at least. Its can technically fall within each, even though we most commonly hear/see it as being the adjective. Moving on--
So, lets look at the personal pronoun we. In no way, shape, or form would we say we's, and if you know anything about etymology, you know that "we's" or "we" does not and cannot turn into "our" or "ours". This proves that our, along with other possessive adjectives are their own words. Now, let's move to those, for a second, to further my point. It would be easy to just say "the apostrophe was omitted" in cases like "our" to "ours" and so forth, but what about the other cases in which the words are more etymologically different; "mine" to "my", "who's" to "whose"? Exactly, they are just different words. Throughout the English language, we have many words that sound and look the same, and they might even be derivative of eachother. However, in English's current state, they are their own entity-- they are their own word, a different word. If you take a step back and think about things loosely, you will see that the same applies to "its". While it does seem weird when you try to think of it as you do, "its" really is just its own word.
That's my take. Take it or leave it.
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
add a comment |
protected by RegDwigнt♦ Feb 15 '12 at 22:38
Thank you for your interest in this question.
Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).
Would you like to answer one of these unanswered questions instead?
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
Professor David Crystal explains it in his book The Fight for English: How language pundits ate, shot, and left (Crystal 2006), pp. 134-135:
Its is just as possessive as cat's, but it doesn't have an apostrophe. Why not? Because the printers and grammarians [of the nineteenth century - Alex B.] never thought the matter through [emphasis mine - Alex B.]. They applied their rule to nouns and forgot about pronouns, thus creating an exception (along with the food is hers, ours, yours, theirs) without realizing it. And even if they had noticed, they wouldn't have done anything about it, for it's was already taken, as it were, as the abbreviation of it is.
I highly recommend this book to anyone interested in languages.
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
1
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
add a comment |
Professor David Crystal explains it in his book The Fight for English: How language pundits ate, shot, and left (Crystal 2006), pp. 134-135:
Its is just as possessive as cat's, but it doesn't have an apostrophe. Why not? Because the printers and grammarians [of the nineteenth century - Alex B.] never thought the matter through [emphasis mine - Alex B.]. They applied their rule to nouns and forgot about pronouns, thus creating an exception (along with the food is hers, ours, yours, theirs) without realizing it. And even if they had noticed, they wouldn't have done anything about it, for it's was already taken, as it were, as the abbreviation of it is.
I highly recommend this book to anyone interested in languages.
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
1
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
add a comment |
Professor David Crystal explains it in his book The Fight for English: How language pundits ate, shot, and left (Crystal 2006), pp. 134-135:
Its is just as possessive as cat's, but it doesn't have an apostrophe. Why not? Because the printers and grammarians [of the nineteenth century - Alex B.] never thought the matter through [emphasis mine - Alex B.]. They applied their rule to nouns and forgot about pronouns, thus creating an exception (along with the food is hers, ours, yours, theirs) without realizing it. And even if they had noticed, they wouldn't have done anything about it, for it's was already taken, as it were, as the abbreviation of it is.
I highly recommend this book to anyone interested in languages.
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
Professor David Crystal explains it in his book The Fight for English: How language pundits ate, shot, and left (Crystal 2006), pp. 134-135:
Its is just as possessive as cat's, but it doesn't have an apostrophe. Why not? Because the printers and grammarians [of the nineteenth century - Alex B.] never thought the matter through [emphasis mine - Alex B.]. They applied their rule to nouns and forgot about pronouns, thus creating an exception (along with the food is hers, ours, yours, theirs) without realizing it. And even if they had noticed, they wouldn't have done anything about it, for it's was already taken, as it were, as the abbreviation of it is.
I highly recommend this book to anyone interested in languages.
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
edited Sep 15 '13 at 4:23
endolith
3451411
3451411
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
answered May 22 '12 at 22:06
Alex B.Alex B.
3,43711922
3,43711922
1
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
add a comment |
1
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
1
1
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
@Anthony's comment exemplifies another issue this answer. Why did "one's" get an apostrophe, but not "ours" or "yours"?
– Mr Purple
Sep 18 '18 at 0:15
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
Right. Why were none of the nouns' apostracized forms "already taken" as the abbreviation of [noun] is? That last statement only makes sense if we're assuming the printers and grammarians were drunk and/or stupid.
– xr280xr
Oct 3 '18 at 16:09
add a comment |
Here are some possessive pronouns:
- My neighbour
- Your friend
- His wife
- Her dog
- Its tail
None of these have apostrophes. See Martin Beckett's answer for the rest.
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
1
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
4
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
5
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
3
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
2
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
|
show 11 more comments
Here are some possessive pronouns:
- My neighbour
- Your friend
- His wife
- Her dog
- Its tail
None of these have apostrophes. See Martin Beckett's answer for the rest.
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
1
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
4
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
5
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
3
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
2
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
|
show 11 more comments
Here are some possessive pronouns:
- My neighbour
- Your friend
- His wife
- Her dog
- Its tail
None of these have apostrophes. See Martin Beckett's answer for the rest.
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
Here are some possessive pronouns:
- My neighbour
- Your friend
- His wife
- Her dog
- Its tail
None of these have apostrophes. See Martin Beckett's answer for the rest.
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
answered Apr 25 '11 at 18:13
LunivoreLunivore
5,70772045
5,70772045
1
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
4
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
5
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
3
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
2
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
|
show 11 more comments
1
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
4
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
5
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
3
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
2
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
1
1
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
That doesn't explain why "its" used to have an apostrophe and no longer does. "His" was "originally also the neut. possessive pronoun, but replaced in that sense c.1600 by its." etymonline.com/index.php?term=his
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:26
4
4
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
I don't buy this argument. Where would you even put an apostrophe in her? The possessive adjectives in modern English are my, your, his, her, its, our, their and whose. But its is the only one in the list constructed by combining the pronoun with 's. If it was removed purely for consistency like this, it would seem to be a case of hypercorrection.
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 21:15
5
5
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
Ah, there is one other possessive produced by combining a pronoun with 's: one's still keeps the apostrophe.
– endolith
Apr 26 '11 at 1:55
3
3
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
I agree with @endolith. My, your, and his are all separate words to me, you, and him. If those first three didn't exist, you'd expect to see me's, you's, and him's instead. Its is directly from 'it' + a possessive s, so there's no valid comparison with the other possessive pronouns.
– Cam Jackson
Dec 14 '11 at 22:45
2
2
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
@tchrist, A quote for you from Huddleston and Pullum 2002: "The dependent and independent genitives are often analysed in traditional grammar as 'possessive adjectives' and 'possessive pronouns' respectively, but we find this an unsatisfactory way of handling the difference between the two sets of forms" (p. 471). See HP2002: 471 for reasons why that traditional distinction doesn't withstand scrutiny.
– Alex B.
May 22 '12 at 22:50
|
show 11 more comments
I was told that the possessive apostrophe was originally a contraction.
"The bear's coat" was originally "the bear his coat" and the apostrophe appeared as the his was gradually shortened — so it would make sense that it is had an apostrophe but its didn't.
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
1
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
15
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
7
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
add a comment |
I was told that the possessive apostrophe was originally a contraction.
"The bear's coat" was originally "the bear his coat" and the apostrophe appeared as the his was gradually shortened — so it would make sense that it is had an apostrophe but its didn't.
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
1
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
15
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
7
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
add a comment |
I was told that the possessive apostrophe was originally a contraction.
"The bear's coat" was originally "the bear his coat" and the apostrophe appeared as the his was gradually shortened — so it would make sense that it is had an apostrophe but its didn't.
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
I was told that the possessive apostrophe was originally a contraction.
"The bear's coat" was originally "the bear his coat" and the apostrophe appeared as the his was gradually shortened — so it would make sense that it is had an apostrophe but its didn't.
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
edited May 22 '12 at 21:35
RegDwigнt♦
83.5k31281382
83.5k31281382
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
answered Apr 25 '11 at 17:53
mgbmgb
22.2k23889
22.2k23889
1
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
15
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
7
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
add a comment |
1
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
15
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
7
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
1
1
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
That's cool. Kind of like how "then" became "than". "The bear is bigger, then the bee" → "The bear is bigger than the bee". etymonline.com/index.php?term=than
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:06
15
15
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
'The 18th century explanation that the apostrophe might replace a genitive pronoun, as in "the king’s horse" being a shortened form of "the king, his horse", is doubtful. This "his genitive" appears in English only for a relatively brief time, and was never the most common form.' en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genitive_case en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_genitive
– endolith
Apr 25 '11 at 18:23
7
7
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
I had heard that it was originally "the beares coat" and the e was replaced with an apostrophe. the '-es' ending being the Old English declension representing the possessive form for masculine and neuter nouns.
– Chris Cudmore
Feb 24 '12 at 14:45
add a comment |
I read through this thread and found that you really do not have an answer. The etymology of all these words, adjectives and pronouns alike, is confusing, to say the least. Additionally, it seems that there are conflicting reasons for everything. Some say that there used to be apostrophes with certain adjectives/pronouns, and some say they never existed. But let me try to help to make this simple. First and foremost, we need to recognize the different categories we have here. We have possessive adjectives and possessive pronouns. For example, hers is a possessive pronoun, while *her" is a possessive adjective, in our current context at least. Its can technically fall within each, even though we most commonly hear/see it as being the adjective. Moving on--
So, lets look at the personal pronoun we. In no way, shape, or form would we say we's, and if you know anything about etymology, you know that "we's" or "we" does not and cannot turn into "our" or "ours". This proves that our, along with other possessive adjectives are their own words. Now, let's move to those, for a second, to further my point. It would be easy to just say "the apostrophe was omitted" in cases like "our" to "ours" and so forth, but what about the other cases in which the words are more etymologically different; "mine" to "my", "who's" to "whose"? Exactly, they are just different words. Throughout the English language, we have many words that sound and look the same, and they might even be derivative of eachother. However, in English's current state, they are their own entity-- they are their own word, a different word. If you take a step back and think about things loosely, you will see that the same applies to "its". While it does seem weird when you try to think of it as you do, "its" really is just its own word.
That's my take. Take it or leave it.
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
add a comment |
I read through this thread and found that you really do not have an answer. The etymology of all these words, adjectives and pronouns alike, is confusing, to say the least. Additionally, it seems that there are conflicting reasons for everything. Some say that there used to be apostrophes with certain adjectives/pronouns, and some say they never existed. But let me try to help to make this simple. First and foremost, we need to recognize the different categories we have here. We have possessive adjectives and possessive pronouns. For example, hers is a possessive pronoun, while *her" is a possessive adjective, in our current context at least. Its can technically fall within each, even though we most commonly hear/see it as being the adjective. Moving on--
So, lets look at the personal pronoun we. In no way, shape, or form would we say we's, and if you know anything about etymology, you know that "we's" or "we" does not and cannot turn into "our" or "ours". This proves that our, along with other possessive adjectives are their own words. Now, let's move to those, for a second, to further my point. It would be easy to just say "the apostrophe was omitted" in cases like "our" to "ours" and so forth, but what about the other cases in which the words are more etymologically different; "mine" to "my", "who's" to "whose"? Exactly, they are just different words. Throughout the English language, we have many words that sound and look the same, and they might even be derivative of eachother. However, in English's current state, they are their own entity-- they are their own word, a different word. If you take a step back and think about things loosely, you will see that the same applies to "its". While it does seem weird when you try to think of it as you do, "its" really is just its own word.
That's my take. Take it or leave it.
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
add a comment |
I read through this thread and found that you really do not have an answer. The etymology of all these words, adjectives and pronouns alike, is confusing, to say the least. Additionally, it seems that there are conflicting reasons for everything. Some say that there used to be apostrophes with certain adjectives/pronouns, and some say they never existed. But let me try to help to make this simple. First and foremost, we need to recognize the different categories we have here. We have possessive adjectives and possessive pronouns. For example, hers is a possessive pronoun, while *her" is a possessive adjective, in our current context at least. Its can technically fall within each, even though we most commonly hear/see it as being the adjective. Moving on--
So, lets look at the personal pronoun we. In no way, shape, or form would we say we's, and if you know anything about etymology, you know that "we's" or "we" does not and cannot turn into "our" or "ours". This proves that our, along with other possessive adjectives are their own words. Now, let's move to those, for a second, to further my point. It would be easy to just say "the apostrophe was omitted" in cases like "our" to "ours" and so forth, but what about the other cases in which the words are more etymologically different; "mine" to "my", "who's" to "whose"? Exactly, they are just different words. Throughout the English language, we have many words that sound and look the same, and they might even be derivative of eachother. However, in English's current state, they are their own entity-- they are their own word, a different word. If you take a step back and think about things loosely, you will see that the same applies to "its". While it does seem weird when you try to think of it as you do, "its" really is just its own word.
That's my take. Take it or leave it.
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
I read through this thread and found that you really do not have an answer. The etymology of all these words, adjectives and pronouns alike, is confusing, to say the least. Additionally, it seems that there are conflicting reasons for everything. Some say that there used to be apostrophes with certain adjectives/pronouns, and some say they never existed. But let me try to help to make this simple. First and foremost, we need to recognize the different categories we have here. We have possessive adjectives and possessive pronouns. For example, hers is a possessive pronoun, while *her" is a possessive adjective, in our current context at least. Its can technically fall within each, even though we most commonly hear/see it as being the adjective. Moving on--
So, lets look at the personal pronoun we. In no way, shape, or form would we say we's, and if you know anything about etymology, you know that "we's" or "we" does not and cannot turn into "our" or "ours". This proves that our, along with other possessive adjectives are their own words. Now, let's move to those, for a second, to further my point. It would be easy to just say "the apostrophe was omitted" in cases like "our" to "ours" and so forth, but what about the other cases in which the words are more etymologically different; "mine" to "my", "who's" to "whose"? Exactly, they are just different words. Throughout the English language, we have many words that sound and look the same, and they might even be derivative of eachother. However, in English's current state, they are their own entity-- they are their own word, a different word. If you take a step back and think about things loosely, you will see that the same applies to "its". While it does seem weird when you try to think of it as you do, "its" really is just its own word.
That's my take. Take it or leave it.
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
answered 1 hour ago
Allex KramerAllex Kramer
815
815
add a comment |
add a comment |
protected by RegDwigнt♦ Feb 15 '12 at 22:38
Thank you for your interest in this question.
Because it has attracted low-quality or spam answers that had to be removed, posting an answer now requires 10 reputation on this site (the association bonus does not count).
Would you like to answer one of these unanswered questions instead?
1
possible duplicate of Why is there a distinction between "its" and "it's"?
– MrHen
Apr 25 '11 at 18:05
4
@MrHen: the accepted answer to that question doesn't answer this one, in fact it contradicts the evidence presented here.
– RegDwigнt♦
Apr 25 '11 at 18:19
1
Also check here for a similar question.
– boehj
May 28 '11 at 5:51
3
I better point out as a Wiktionary contributor myself that it is just a wiki that anybody can edit much like here anybody can answer. We never have had any contributors who are trained in etymology or lexicography. We try our best but we don't claim to be authoritative.
– hippietrail
May 28 '11 at 7:58
2
+1 for giving sufficient background that my first guess at an explanation was rendered invalid before I finished reading the question.
– Ryan Reich
May 28 '11 at 12:46